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- Hacker News
- Google on their proposal:
> Browsers and operating systems are increasingly expected to gain access to language models.
I think this is only true amongst “AI all the things” folks. Both tech and non-tech people around me are more focused on turning these features off. Some even avoid sensitive actions like banking from LLM infused browsers.
So I think Mozilla is right to object. This API is not in the interest of the user/agent.
by isodev - > This will result in Mozilla and Apple having to licence Google's model, or ship a model that's quirks-compatible with the Google model in order to be interoperable. It may also become difficult for Chrome to update its own model for the same reasons.
Google is again doing Evil.
I am very annoyed that Google kind of de-facto controls the www (through chrome, let's be honest here).
We really need to change this. I don't have a good solution here, but it can not continue that way.
by shevy-java - Only have yourselves to blame. Chrome made the internet better but everyone put their fingers in their ears about it getting worse at the same time.by youre-wrong3
- Chrome is not that good anymore compared to other browsers. I switched long time ago and if the doesn't work with basic features I just leave the site out instead of letting it use chrome to control meby motbus3
- Lina Khan's FTC sought to break Google into multiple companies, leaving Chrome alone. Alas, Google escaped unscathed.by thrance
- > We really need to change this. I don't have a good solution here, but it can not continue that way.
Advocacy (against chromium and its forks) is one way.
by jraph - I’m kinda terrified by the security implications of the Prompt API.
This is a way for web services to make your computer complete large amounts of compute at their behest. Tokens have value. There will be incentive for bad actors to use your local LLM for their own purposes, much like hostile crypto mining payloads.
This is an obvious target for prompt injection attacks and other malicious remote code execution. In many ways, model prompts ARE programs. The browser / local device would need to provide an LLM with the same sandbox guarantees as the rest of the browser. Can they be trusted to do that? Does anyone understand this well enough to do that with confidence?
I’m a big fan of local models, but I would be very cautious about letting random websites call the model I’m hosting on my local machine with open source software.
by pbronez - > Does anyone understand this well enough to do that with confidence?
Pretty sure Chrome wouldn't ship if they weren't confident. And Firefox would object based on security grounds if they saw such an issue
by tln - Yeah I wonder, who says I can't build a "cryptominer like" script that injects into many websites and just uses this local LLM api, performs a request from a queue and sends the response to a server, practically creating my very own LLM botnet?by LauraMedia
- What's the usecase for this API?
My experience with running LLMs locally is spinnnig up llama-server (possibly on a separate machine) and then configuring other applications to point to that OpenAI compatible web server instead of OpenAI or similar.
I don't want a web browser creating/running an LLM instance as that machine may not have the capability or capacity to run an LLM instance.
by rhdunn - I wonder if this is a generational thing of fresh young people that already cannot live without LLMs versus crusty old people that don’t want to require a super computer just to run a web browser that violates all their privacy.
To me this sounds like the point where people start looking at and developing alternatives to the browser/web.
- > that don’t want to require a super computer just to run a web browser that violates all their privacy.
That shipped sailed in 2008.
by GaryBluto - IME young people mostly hate AI.
- A little off-topic, I honestly don't think it's as much as the browser interface that needs to be reworked as it is the idea of operating systems in general.
I don't know what the right answer is, but having used Niri/Wayland vs. GNOME vs. Windows vs. Mac... I will never go back to a non-tiling desktop and a none-kb driven workflow for desktop window management.
- I think the objection here is unrelated to the love or hate of LLMs. It's about the viability of this particular proposed open web API.
I personally use LLMs for coding assistance, and some home automation stuff, but I do not think this particular API is good for the web.
by jaffathecake - This isn’t Mozilla taking a stance against AI.
It’s them articulating clear and logical reasons why the proposed API, in its current state, is bad for web interoperability.
by dannyw - Why is it that Google is fixated on bolting on ever more junk and turning browsers into Homermobiles[0] instead of putting those vast resources towards fixing the numerous structural weaknesses in everything that browsers are already capable of? Why not focus on foundational things that will improve quality of life for everything on the web platform ranging from static blogs to e-commerce to cutting edge web apps?
Really, I just can’t understand it.
- How would not implementing a prompt API make them dedicate their resources to something else they didn't consider important before? This seems like a false dichotomy.by lxgr
- If you want to go for promo at Google, you gotta launch a prompt APIby bloppe
- Chrome is an operating system for Google. It gives them a way into corporate environments that run Windows far more easily than getting those companies to convert to ChromeOS or something. So they keep adding features because they want users to be able to do just about anything in there.by afavour
- Google doesn't build Chrome to make a better web. Building a good browser for the sake of building a good browser is throwing billions towards goodwill while Google's goal with Chrome is to further replace the user's OS as the platform users do things on their devices with.
Google has Android & ChromeOS to directly try to do that but Chrome makes it so the average user using e.g. Windows still ends up in a Google world most of the time.
by zamadatix - The nice thing about open protocols is that we don't have to endorse or use one implementation over another, yet, somehow, the browser monopoly continues to be a standing dilemma.
There are nice projects, like ungoogled chromium, tor, and many more, but I find the biggest issue is that there isn't a voice out there for the average person and a project that connects with the masses.
I think another issue is that a lot of the uninformed users have a strong apathy for the causes and ways the message is delivered, they rather engage and connect with things that are "fun" and want less friction rather than freedom and control.
How do we solve this? How do we make the browser ours, by the people, and for the people?
Sorry, I'm just sad whenever I think of this.
by hmokiguess - by ilaksh
- You have a decent browser. The average person has Chrome. Those who do care switch to the former. What needs to be solved?
> voice out there for the average person and a project that connects with the masses
> they rather engage and connect with things that are "fun" and want less friction rather than freedom and control
Do you see the contradiction? The average person "connects with" less friction rather than control.
- The problem is that if there were one, it would be subverted by powerful people with enormous amounts of cash to throw around. Firefox was the people's browser, then it suddenly wasn't.
If you were some paragon of integrity with a ton of money, developed everything yourself, and refused all corruption, you would be called the Russian Chinese terrorist child-porn browser, denounced in Congress, and eventually arrested (then released) during a layover in Germany.
Google would send an opinion to the court vaguely supporting the prosecution but disguised as technical advice; Firefox would pretend they never heard of you or what is happening, and delete all mention of you when posted in comments or on their social media. Ubuntu and Fedora would remove you from their repositories, Apple and Android never allowed you in their stores in the first place. The NYT would do a story about your "shadowy origins" and ask whether a reasonable country should allow a company so unwilling to work with the government or selected nonprofits to be an intermediary between their children and a dangerous internet. Fox would call you an Islamo-Communist anti-Semite, and somehow also associate you with the "alt-right," Dr. Fauci, and "environmental whackos."
After two years, and the banning of your project by most companies and websites, and the contrived failure of other companies simply associated with you but unrelated to the browser, the charges will be dropped. The bans will still be there, and where they are gone, people will informally stick to them. People will not feel like they can put your company on their resume. Any casual mention of you on the social internet will inspire at least a half-dozen hate comments, and FOSS projects will be attacked for ever having mentioned you positively.
If you aren't a paragon, you sell out after the NYT story.
The reason there are monopolies is because they are enforced.
by pessimizer - > How do we solve this? How do we make the browser ours, by the people, and for the people?
Unfortunately, the answer is pretty much always "real public funding"
by jedimastert - > How do we solve this? How do we make the browser ours, by the people, and for the people?
Simple. Break up all the big tech corporations via anti-trust legislation. They are the robber barons of our time.
- We start by not shipping Chrome with "native" applications instead of learning the platform APIs.
Followed by creating Web applications based on Web standards, instead of whatever Chrome does, and then complain about Firefox and Safari not being up to the game.
by pjmlp - It's somehow even worse when you compile your own browser. Want Spotify or Netflix? You need Widevine with attestation. Go pay Google.
Your Browser Agent string isn't Chrome or Firefox? Enjoy endless Cloudflare captchas or just a 403 error.
by Joe_Cool - The more I think about it, the more I think I align with Google's API design on this one.
The tight coupling between prompts and models is a real concern. I deal with that every day. However: if your solution to that is to support an API that enables tighter coupling between the model the user's browser has and the prompt that gets evaluated, you will inevitably and quickly enter the domain of "You need to use Chrome to use this site (because our prompts were only tested on Gemini)" or even worse "We don't recognize the AI model you're using (because the website was written in 2026 and the current year is 2030 and they never updated it)".
This is related to the terms of use concerns the Mozilla engineer has later; real concerns. But, if we want browsers to exist that don't require users to opt-in to the terms of use of a specific AI model (e.g. using a nice open source model), its beneficial to these browsers that they can't fingerprint for the Big Models.
Of course many sites will just do an isChrome()-like call anyway. Nothing to be done about that. But yeah I am generally non-supportive of changes that introduce more ways to fingerprint browsers. The upside of keeping the model anonymous outweighs the slight downside of (rarely) encountering weird prompt evaluation output because of a small difference in behavior between Gemini and, idk, Qwen.
by 827a