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- Hacker News
- I expect that every major venue is using this technology now. You'd be pretty naive to think otherwise. And keeping lists of people they find "interesting" just goes along with that -- otherwise what's the point?by SoftTalker
- The biggest threat to a future society worth living in, is not the evil ones among us. Those are usually pretty visible and in the minority.
It's the complacent ones we have to keep an eye on: they are absolutely everywhere.
by ghurtado - I know this sounds like a conspiracy theory, so I'm not subscribing without more validation, BUT:
I think MSG has the ability to ID every person at the Knicks game who booed for DJT, and you know how petty and sensitive that person can be.
Remember when Hegseth invited all the generals into one big room for some reason? Some people think that it was to point cameras at their faces and do a bit of sentiment analysis.
The tech is in place. Is there enough decency or the lack of enough motivation to make these scenarios unlikely? I'm not sure.
by crumpled - Presumably they could use a real-life human with good memory instead of computers. Would that solve anything?by randyrand
- List of Honor. I'm grateful these brave people exist.by emsign
- Any private individual or organization has the right to Bar anyone else from their facility. Madison square garden is simply doing it at scale. I pretty much hate everything MSG is about, but they have a perfectly acceptable right to do this.by silexia
- I'm convinced that a dominate use of all the exploding construction of data centers will be to ramp up spying on citizens, likely in the name of "fighting terrorism". The same is being used to require I.D for every internet user in the name of fighting child porn. The AT&T case with technician Klein proves that the government will secretly and continuously violate the laws of the land to serve their own purposes.
- Please watch/listen to the Pablo Torre podcast about this one for additional context:
https://www.pablo.show/p/inside-james-dolans-deep-state?utm_...
If you don't know, Pablo recently won a Pulitzer for his reporting on Steve Balmer's deal with Aspiration. If you listened only to mainstream media, you would think "Poor Steve, he was duped!" But, Pablo's reporting might change your opinion on that one.
The incredible volume of high quality, well researched shows are so refreshing as an antidote to Joe Rogan and Theo Vaughn, who seem to come into every interview with just the right amount of ignorance to let every guest spew whatever propaganda they want. Pablo never lets that happen.
by xrd - Aspiration?by zulux
- Related:
The Shocking Secrets of Madison Square Garden’s Surveillance Machine: https://www.wired.com/story/madison-square-garden-jim-dolan-...
Archive/paywall: https://archive.ph/iiczs
Post on the MSG data breach: https://www.404media.co/hackers-publish-knicks-and-madison-s...
Archive/paywall: https://archive.ph/qh3UQ
Shinyhunters website: http://shnyhntww34phqoa6dcgnvps2yu7dlwzmy5lkvejwjdo6z7bmgshz...
by Cider9986 - Personally I think that these conversations are focused on the wrong thing. Facial recognition stands to be a great tool in spotting "the bad guys" so that appropriate measures can be taken. For example preventing people who have repeatedly been convicted of violence ("hooliganism") from entering sports stadiums.
The problem that is not being missed in the conversation about the technology is: who gets to decide who is excluded, how transparent to the need to be about this decision making process, and what is the course of appeals. Obviously the instance where MSG silently black-listed the lawyers representing their opponents in a court case is an obvious abuse that needs to be curbed.
I would propose that there be tiers: smaller venues only get dinged when their behavior is obviously bad (no need for formal systems, let people sue if it becomes a problem), mid tier need to post their rules, and large companies are subject to audits and formal rules about when they are allowed to blacklist people.
by larkost - Why shouldn't they be able to blacklist lawyers? If I owned a restaurant and was being sued by opposing attorneys, I think it would be perfectly normal and acceptable to bar those attorneys from my restaurant.by silexia
- No. Processing biometric data like facial features must require person's consent. Individual's rights are more important than interests of capitalists. If someone is a hooligan they should be put in jail not denied entry.by codedokode
- > For example preventing people who have repeatedly been convicted of violence ("hooliganism") from entering sports stadiums.
You should't need face recognition to do this (as it seems stadiums are already successful in banning people who haven't paid from entering the venue).
by nulld3v - Nah. I don't buy it. If we don't trust our own Government with it, I don't think we can trust private corporations which are definitely facto extensions of the state by virtue of being legal fictions with it.
Vigilance is the price of liberty, and I don't believe that that there is any reason to make that vigilance "easy" for those already more than capable of doing a reasonable job of it with means that don't create a giant liability of biometric data leaks for everyone else.
by salawat - Debating this specific dossier ignores the larger issue, IMO:
> MSG has deployed facial recognition technology since 2018 to identify people entering the venue. MSG’s facial recognition systems have been used to block entry to the stadium for all sorts of people. The list includes lawyers who work at law firms in litigation with MSG, even if they are not part of the litigation themselves; and potentially a man who once made a shirt that criticized Dolan.
> The document was included in a 45GB cache of data hackers stole from MSG and posted online this month
MSG management is not only misusing facial recognition data, they're also so inept as to store it insecurely in a way that violates their own customer's privacy.
We need laws around this stuff. And in the meantime NYC should start playing hardball: if they're going to arbitrarily block people from entering MSG based on corporate vendetta then they need to lose their tax exemption (well, they should anyway...)
https://reinventalbany.org/2023/02/watchdog-supports-state-b...
by afavour - > We need laws around this stuff.
The EU created laws around this (GDPR). Americans seem to hate them.
by munksbeer - > they need to lose their tax exemption
Easy, easy! Are you proposing that venerable people should get less breads for the circuses they provide to plebs?
by wartywhoa23 - > then they need to lose their tax exemption (well, they should anyway...)
I'm 1000% in favor of not having a tax exemption for this business, it's idiotic to give them one in the first place, but I disagree that the exemption should be used to pressure them here. For one thing, that means if they comply with those demands, then they keep the exemption they shouldn't have.
I fail to see how a ban on facial recognition altogether is something we need laws for. Any private entity deserves to keep out whoever they want. Who cares if it's by having a bouncer at each entrance with pictures of all the 'personae non gratae' or with a camera? "Going to a Knicks game" is not a protected constitutional right, and I fully support everyone's right to not give MSG or the Knicks or Rangers your money whether it's because you hate facial recognition or just hate this Dolan guy, or whatever. But when you go into a private home or business, I think they do have the right to (as long as it's disclosed) take your picture and also to throw you out.
FAQ: Do I think Dolan is being petty or paranoid by banning every lawyer from the firm suing him? Sure, but that's his loss. I don't want to create a precedent that I have to invite you into my private property, and can't deny you entry for your past behavior, or because I don't like who you associate with.
We created laws, that I agree with, saying you can't ban whole protected classes like races from 'public accommodations' (private businesses that are generally open to the public) This isn't that though. It's individuals who are not welcome.
by xp84 - > MSG management is not only misusing facial recognition data
This is making a huge assumption that the goal was ever safety.
by gypsy_boots - The stadium pays no property tax. Its a bummer some enterprising pro-bono lawyer hasnt bullied some clever points of leverage onto city subsidized projects that strip some of the god-like powers to deny access from these places.
On a personal note, James Dolan seems universally disliked by staff, fans and regular people alike. It's almost impressive.
by beepbopboopp - by 382hi