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- Hacker News
- TBF, Americans say "NIMBY" to everythingby steveBK123
- It's a long-standing tradition. Our forefathers famously said "NIMBY" to taxation without representation.
- America is so massive, these trillion dollar companies can surely build these out in the boonies with very few people around?
ETA: I would rather no data centers be built, but my point is if we have to, let’s minimize the number of people who are affected. Offer to move them if need be.
- They need to hire IT, maintainence, and security to run the datacenters, and there aren't many qualified people in the boonies. Small towns are better targets, and honestly also just objectively less damaging to the environment.
None of this NIMBYism is about the datacenter itself, it's all a protest against AI making the economy really shitty for them.
by qurren - I propose we build one under Sam Altman's house.by yoyohello13
- I agree with you, but even then it's still going to be someone's backyardby aqme28
- I wonder the same thing. It could be that getting transition grid interconnects and redundant fiber paths is much faster in more suburban areas vs rural areas.by lokar
- Even then they can wind up in the proverbial backyard. I don't know much about data center staffing needs and zoning laws but those would seem relevant spatial constraints and considerations.by dieselgate
- It's generally more expensive for them when it comes to things like power, water and internet.
Boonies have very poor in each of those and building it up would take too long so throw another in Northern Virginia since they have expensive access to additional of that but at least it will become operational.
by stackskipton - And ruin the boonies too? American norms and laws are not conducive to making nice places to live, but they've skated by having enough land and car-first infrastructure. With the huge increase in warehouses and data centers in residential areas over the past 5-10 years, I wonder if there will be an inflection point where it finally needs to be dealt with.by duskdozer
- We could in a vacuum, but they require human labor and human labor isn't found in the boonies.
It's the age old problem. The people in the cities cry that there are no jobs and the rural businesses cry that they can't find anyone to hire, with no great resolution as the businesses cannot afford to move into the city and the people don't want to travel to the boonies.
However, in this case, these data centers are so well capitalized that they can afford to move them into the cities right beside where the workers are located.
by win311fwg - I would flip my bitch switch if a datacenter was stood up near me, where I could hear it. I am on 5 acres in rural Michigan surrounded by peace and quiet. I specifically came here for this reason. At the same time, I understand that we need datacenters. And tbh, Michigan is under-served in this space (ex, most of my queries thru the Cloudflare network have to go to Chicago first), and I wish we had more. But not close to residential areas. Not on top of valuable farmland.
My wacky idea was that datacenters should be built on EPA superfund sites. It becomes a win-win. Datacenter gets land that humans cannot occupy, helps/funds partial cleanup, slaps a big ass concrete building down on top of the rest of the mess and kills two birds with one stone. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Superfund_sites
Also thoughts of mine recently: why are we not doing subterranean datacenters, why are we not doing tall/skinny skyscraper like datacenters (versus enormous sprawling warehouse-style).
by whalesalad - Oh yeah right, underground data centers. What are you going to say next, data centers in space? Be real.by f33d5173
- >Also thoughts of mine recently: why are we not doing subterranean datacenters, why are we not doing tall/skinny skyscraper like datacenters (versus enormous sprawling warehouse-style).
It's cheaper this way.
- > Also thoughts of mine recently: why are we not doing subterranean datacenters, why are we not doing tall/skinny skyscraper like datacenters (versus enormous sprawling warehouse-style).
Because it costs an order of magnitude more money to build underground or build a skyscraper than it does it build a precast concrete tilt-up warehouse.
You can build a single story warehouse building with as large of a floor plate as you want, it could be hundreds of square miles if you didn’t need any utilities inside of it. Obviously you do need utilities which limit the overall building size because of things like voltage drop, pump sizing, etc.
Excavating that much earth, building a concrete underground structure, and then covering it, or erecting a steel and concrete tower is much more work than having precast wall sections shipped in from the prefab plant which are then tilted into place with cranes and secured to the concrete slab foundation.
- We built data centers for decades without issue.
One I used to service frequently is actually surrounded by a large area of green-space, trees, marsh area, wildlife. The houses that border it are highly desirable as you effectively have an extension of a massive yard and great views relative to the suburban area surrounding it.
Somehow things changed and it's a bit surreal.
by duxup - The power density has been steadily increasing over the years, and then going from CPU to GPU makes it even bigger. This wouldn't be such a big issue if they actually took the time to build the infrastructure. But nobody has time, so it is gas turbines and evaporative cooling, and that makes a horrible neighbour.by NohatCoder
- most americans say not in my backyard to more housing in their backyard too, but i digress.by sabujp
- The whole world is California, and the most important thing we can do is pack more and more people into the same space. People from here, people from there. We want more crowdedness, and everyhing that comes with it: crime, noise, pollution, lack of social cohesion. Everything. Every place must be like this, and everything must grow forever.by everdrive
- What kind of reason would you possibly have to write the sentence you did?
Why did you?
by izacus - The article puts that percentage at 39%, which falls a bit short of “most” but is frighteningly high.by freeone3000
- I don't want a data center in my back yard because I do want housing in my back yard.
Once a data center shows up, that plot of land is locked out of more productive development for decades.
by alright2565 - First thing missing from this "article" is a number indicating how many people don't want AI datacentres anywhere. You can't claim that someone is a NIMBY if their stance is that the damned thing shouldn't be built anywhere.by NohatCoder
- Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to everything
I'm not saying they should want a data center in their backyard but headline wise "not in my backyard" is true of almost everything.
by socalgal2 - Luckily, at least public opinion toward housing and zoning density is inching towards a YIMBY majority.by foco_tubi
- They're just awful to live near; the folks that are clamoring for more cheap tokens should try moving in next door to the token factory.by mrhottakes
- There is a study from ASU that found they are awful to live within....1200ft of.by WarmWash
- They probably would be awful to have a house next to, but which if the hyperscale data center proposals are near residential areas?
The really large data centers have to go into areas with a lot of land and utility connections. These are usually zoned commercial or industrial already.
by Aurornis - Your dad's data centers are very different to the new GPU focused beasts.
The AI data centers consume a lot more power, and thus generate a lot more heat(equals cooling noise) per square meter.
This is the reason why it's a new problem right now.
Edit: autocorrect used breasts instead of beasts.
by grim_io - Your edit really illustrates what's wrong with all of this. We can't even get computers to reasonably assume what we're trying to say. But somehow the ultra rich have decided to devote all global resources to doing bad autocorrect for everything everywhere and calling it AI.by kdheiwns